Dr. Ambedkar As The Member
of Executive Governor General Council
Questions and Answers
______________________________________________
232
[f.1]
The Indian Trade Unions (Amendment) Bill
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar (Labour Member) : I do not propose to make the motion that
stands in my name.
233
[f.2]
Delhi Electric Supply and Traction Company
419.
Mr. K. C. Neogy: (a) Will the Honourable the Labour Member be pleased to state whether it
is a fact that the Delhi Electric Supply and Traction Company Limited, is a company
incorporated outside India ? How long has this Company been operating in the Delhi
Province and what is the area served by it ?
(b)
How many units of electricity did this Company use for traction purposes, how many units
did it sell to consumers in its area of supply during the past twelve months or so, how
many units out of its total supply did it generate from its own power station, and how
many units did the Company buy from the Delhi Central Electric Power Authority Limited ?
(c)
Is it a fact that the Delhi Electric Supply and Traction Company Limited has not increased
the supply of current from its generating station to any considerable extent for a number
of years, and has been for some time, for all practical purposes, dependent upon the
Government power station at present under the control of the Delhi Central Electric Power
Authority Limited ?
(d)
Is it a fact that the Delhi Central Electric Power Authority Limited is a company
sponsored by Government and works on a no-profit basis ?
(e)
What is the price that the Delhi Electric Supply and Traction Company Limited pays per
unit of electricity supplied by the Delhi Central Electric Power Authority Limited, and
what are the different rates at which the Delhi Electric Supply and Traction Company
Limited sells electricity to its different classes of customers ?
(f)
Is it a fact that the Government have an option to purchase the Delhi Electric Supply and
Traction Company Limited in February, 1947, when their present licence expires, provided a
notice is served on the Company in February 1945 ? If so, has the question of exercising
the option been considered as yet, and with what result ?
(g)What is the amount that the Government will
have to pay in case they decide to purchase this undertaking, and to what extent will the
purchase enable the Government to utilise the sterling balance held to the credit of India
in England ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R.
Ambedkar : (a) Yes. The Company's licence runs from the 2nd March 1905: The area of supply
now includes;
(i)
the whole of the area in the jurisdiction of the Delhi Municipal Committee;
(ii)
the whole of the Delhi Civil Station Notified Area; (iii) the whole of the West Delhi
Notified Area; and (iv) a tract of land in the jurisdiction of the Delhi District Board.
(b) During war-time it is not in the public interest to supply the information.
(c)
Yes. The Company's generating plant is now used more or less as a stand-by.
(d)
Yes.
(e)
A statement is laid on the table.
(f)
Yes. The question is now under the consideration of the Chief Commissioner, Delhi.
(g)
Under the first proviso to sub-section (1) of section 7 of the Indian Electricity Act,
1910, the price to be paid for the property of the licence, if the option of purchasing
were exercised, would be its fair market value at the time of purchase of determined by
arbitration. It is not possible to answer the second half of the question till the amount
likely to be involved is known.
STATEMENT
The
Delhi Electric Supply and Traction Co. Ltd., are charged at 69 anna per unit of
electricity supplied in bulk by the Delhi Central Electric Power Authority Limited.
Rates
charged by the Delhi Electric Supply and Traction Co. Ltd. Lighting and fans—Three
annas per unit less 3 pies discount per unit for prompt payment of bills.
Domestic
power, (Cooling, water heating, refrigerators, radiators and air conditioning)—One
anna per unit nett.
Battery
charging—Two annas per unit less ten per cent discount for prompt payment of bills.
Industrial—
A
Consumer with connected load up to 75 K.V.A. Restricted hour supply—I.I anna per unit
less a discount of .1 anna per unit for prompt payment of bills.
Unrestricted
hour supply—Rates as for Restricted hour supply and in addition a charge of Rs. 5 per
H. P. per month less ten per cent discount for prompt payment of bills. Special rates are
quoted.
Mr.
K. C. Neogy : Is the Honourable Member aware that a few years ago, the Delhi Municipal
Committee applied for a licence for the purpose of enabling itself to supply electricity
in the area concerned or at least part of it and that as a result of that application, an
enquiry was held into the position of this company by a Committee over which perhaps Sir
James Pitkcathly presided or the Electrical Adviser to the Government of Bengal, presided
? Is the Honourable Member in a position to give this House an idea about the comments
made by this Committee or these individuals, in regard to the affairs of this company ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
If the Honourable Member will put down a specific question, I shall certainly be glad to
give the information.
Mr.
K. C. Neogy : Has the Honourable Member tried to ascertain the total amount of profits
earned by this Company ? Has the attention of the Honourable Member been drawn to a
statement in a recent article in the Hindustan Times in which it has been stated that the
total profits earned by the company was already about five times its capital ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : Yes, Sir, I
have noticed.
Mr. K. C. Neogy : Is the Honourable Member in a
position to say whether that is a fact or not ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
I cannot say anything about that now. If the Honourable Member wants information, he will
give notice of a question.
Mr.
K. C. Neogy: With reference to part (b) May I know the proportion of units actually
produced by this company to the units purchased by the company at cost price from the
Government undertakings ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : I
have already answered that during war time, it is not in the public interest to give the
information.
Mr. K. C. Neogy : I know. Is the Honourable Member in
a position to deny that it is a very small proportion of the units actually distributed by
this company that is produced by it ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar
: That, I am afraid, will be circumventing the provisions of the Act which prohibits me
from giving the information.
Mr.
K. C.
Neogy : I did not know that the Honourable Member was prevented even from giving the
proportion. However, I give up that point. As regards the point that the matter is under
consideration of the Chief Commissioner having regard to the important policy involved do
Government propose to direct the Chief Commissioner in regard to coming to any particular
conclusion, or do the Government of India merely propose to carry out, or rather endorse,
the decision of the Chief Commissioner in this behalf?
The
Honourable Dr. .B. R. Ambedkar :
The Government of India themselves are considering this matter.
Mr.
K. C. Neogy: With regard to part (f), having regard to the shortness of lime during which
notice is to be served, if at all, will the Government come to a very quick decision in
the matter ? Will the Government be pleased to take this House into their confidence at
the earliest possible opportunity in regard to this case ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar:
I can assure my Honourable friend that Government will certainly come to its own
conclusions before the time expires.
Mr.
K. C. Neogy : Having regard to the fact that this Legislature is virtually in the position
of a Provincial Legislature so far as Delhi Province is concerned, does the Honourable
Member propose to let this House have an opportunity to consider and discuss this matter ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : I
shall bear the Honourable Member's suggestion in mind.
Mr. R. R. Gupta: Do the Government propose to
increase the capacity of the electric power house situated in New Delhi under the
Government control ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar:
That question does not arise. I cannot give an answer.
234
[f.3]
Refusal of Facilities to All-India Womens
Conference for Studying the Condition of Women in Coal Mines
579.
Mrs. Renuka Ray : Will the Honourable the
Labour Member
please
state:
(a)
if it is a fact that the All-India Women's Conference approached the Government for
facilities to send an investigation Committee for an impartial studying of women in coal
mines and that on the 3rd May, the Government of India informed the aforesaid organisation
that there was no objection against such investigation, and the time was not suitable at
present; and
(b)
if it is a fact that subsequently on a request from the All-India Women's Conference on
the 26th May, the Government of India again refused the facilities and informed them that
Government would let them know when the lime was suitable and that upto now the All-India
Women's Conference has not heard from the Government; what the causes are which led to
this course of action ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar:
(a) Yes.
(b)
the reply to the first part of the question is in the affirmative. The reasons were
explained in the Government of India's letters to the President of the Conference.
Mr.
K. C. Neogy: May I know the reasons which led the Government to pass the order referred to
in part (b) ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : The time was not suitable.
Mr.
N. M. Joshi : What does the Government mean by saying that the time was not suitable ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar
: I think the word ' suitable ' is a very
simple word. Everybody can understand it. I do not think I can further simplify it.
Mrs.
Renuka Ray : Is it a fact that the Government allowed the Regge and the Health Survey
Committees to go and investigate during the same period ? Is it a fact that the All-India
Women's organisation has not been given similar permission till now ? If so, what is the
basis for such differentiation ? Why is it that a responsible body like the All-India
Women's organisation who are interested in the welfare of women has not been allowed ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
They are official bodies which were allowed.
Mrs. Renuka Ray : Are not the Members of the
Legislature on that Committee?
Mr. President (The Honourable Sir Abdul Rahim) : The
Honourable Member is arguing.
Mr.
T. S. Avinashilingam Chettiar : Why are women stopped from going into the mines and
investigating? Why should Government consider that the time is not suitable only in the
case of Women's organisation ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
The Honourable Member can draw his own inference.
Mr.
N. M. Joshi : May I ask whether it is not a fact that Government do not consider the time
suitable because the conditions in the mines are so bad that they do not like
investigation being made by an impartial body ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
The Honourable Member is at liberty to draw his own inferences.
Mr. President (The Honourable Sir Abdul Rahim) : Next
question.
235
[f.4]
Shortage of Labour in Coal Mines due to Malaria
580.
Mrs. Renuka Ray : Will the Honourable the
Labour Member please stale:
(a)
if it is a fact that the shortage of labour in coal mines, particularly during the months
of August and September was due to a large proportion of mining labour suffering from
malaria and that no adequate treatment was possible due to the inadequate supply of
quinine; and
(b) if the Honourable Member is aware of the fact
that mining labour is suffering so acutely from the effects of diseases and malnutrition
that this has seriously affected their efficiency; if so, what steps taken to remedy this
are ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : (a) The
coal-mining labour is not immune to the seasonal incidence of malaria, but it is not
correct to say that a large proportion of this labour suffered from the disease during
August and September. The incidence of the disease per thousand of the average daily
labour force employed in the Jharia Coalfield was 81 and 80 for the month of August in
1943 and 1944 respectively and III and 74 for the month of September in 1943 and 1944
respectively. Every effort is made to provide adequate facilities for treatment and
sufficient supplies of quinine and its substitutes.
(b)
It cannot be said that mining labour is suffering acutely from malnutrition. As regards
their health all collieries employing 30 persons or more are required to maintain a
dispensary and distribute medicines through their doctors. Coal Mines Labour Welfare Fund
has recently been set up from which measures for prevention of disease in the mining
population and improvement of medical facilities will be financed.
Mr.
K. C. Neogy : With regard to the point about malnutrition, will the Honourable Member
please make a statement as to whether it is not a fact and an admitted fact that apart
from the shortage of labour in collieries, individual output of work has gone down due to
malnutrition ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : I
am not certain about the facts mentioned by my Honourable friend.
Mr.
K. C. Neogy : Will the Honourable Member make an enquiry from the Honourable the Supply
Member, who, I understand made a statement to this effect on a recent occasion when he met
one of the Chambers of Commerce.
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
There is no need for an enquiry as the Honourable Member seems to be in possession of the
fact.
Mr.
K. C. Neogy : Will the Honourable Member convince himself about the truth of this position
?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
Yes, I know there has been some fall in production, but I understood it was entirely due
to the fact that there was lack of machinery.
Mrs.
Renuka Ray : As the Honourable Member has told us about dispensaries in the different
mines, will he kindly investigate and find out what the medical facilities are and how far
the dispensaries are working and giving medicines in the mines at Ranigunj and Jharia ? My
information is that some of them cannot work because there are not enough medicines.
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
As I said, it was because in the opinion of
Government the facilities were not sufficient that Government established the coal Mines
Labour Welfare Fund.
236
[f.5]
Cases
of Employment of Children on Underground Work in Mines
581.
Mrs. Renuka Ray : Will the Honourable the Labour Member please state:
(a)
if he is aware of the fact that there are a growing number of cases of violation of the
Act prohibiting children in underground work in mines ?
(b)
if the answer is in the affirmative, what the steps taken to ensure the enforcement of the
Act are; and
(c)
if the answer is in the negative, will the Honourable Member kindly investigate the matter
and take effective steps to put a stop to any such illegal practice that may prevail ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar:
(a) No. (b) Does not arise.
(c)
Inspections are regularly made by the Officers of the Department of Mines to enforce the
provisions of the Indian Mines Act regarding the prohibition of employment of children in
mines and effective steps will be taken as a mailer of course if any such illegal practice
prevails anywhere.
Mrs. Renuka Ray : Is the Honourable Member aware that
there is a growing number of cases of violation in some of the mines in Jharia and
Ranigunj coalfields and that children of 14 and 15 are signed up as adults and actually go
down the mines ? And what does the Honourable Member propose to do about it?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : If the Honourable Member has any specific cases having
reference to specific mines and will bring them to my notice, I will certainly take the
matter up.
237
[f.6]
Underground Work in Mines by Pregnant Women
582.
Mrs. Renuka Ray : Will the Honourable the Labour Member please state:
(a)
if he is aware of the fact that pregnant women usually work underground in mines until the
ninth month and again a fortnight after child birth, and that in mines where maternity
benefits are not given they work even longer ?
(b)
the steps Government have taken to stop pregnant women from working underground;
(c)
if it is a fact that there have been a certain number of accidents to women working
underground within the last year and there is no way of ascertaining how many of these
accidents have occurred to pregnant women; and
(d)
if it is a fact that maternity benefits are given only in some mines; what steps
Government intend to lake to make maternity benefits compulsory for all women working in
mining areas ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : (a) I am not aware of the basis for this allegation. Under
section 3 of the Mines Maternity Benefit Act, employment of a woman for a period of four
weeks following her confinement is prohibited. Further a woman is entitled to leave of
absence for a period of one month before she expects to be delivered of a child.
Inspections under this Act are regularly made by the Labour Inspectors under the Chief
Inspector of Mines, ail of whom are doctors, with a view to enforcing the provisions of
the Act and the rules made thereunder.
(b)
As already stated, pregnant women are entitled to leave of absence for a period of one
month before the date of delivery; and the object of the employment of Labour Inspectors
under the Chief Inspector of Mines is to make known to these women their rights under the
Act and to assist them in securing the benefits of that Act.
(c)
Yes, but no information of any of these women being pregnant has been received. During
enquiries following accidents, the evidence of the colliery doctor is invariably recorded
and if a woman were pregnant her condition would be disclosed and recorded.
(d)
The Mines Maternity Benefit Act 1941 applies to all mines in British India except:
(i)
certain stone crushing plants forming part of mines in the province of Bombay;
(ii)
iron ore mines worked without mechanical power, the whole of the ore from which is
supplied totally to village smelters and blacksmiths; and
(iii)
those mines in which excavation is being carried out for prospecting purposes only,
provided not more than 20 persons are employed in or about such excavation and subject to
certain other conditions.
It
is not considered necessary to make maternity benefits compulsory in these small mines.
Mr.
Lalchand Navalrai : Have there actually been any cases of pregnant women having suffered ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
Yes, there have been some. Mr. Lalchand
Navalrai : When ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
Since they started working. These accidents are often occurring in the coal mines.
Mrs. Renuka Ray: Will the Honourable Member tell us
whether the best way of preventing pregnant women from going down the mines would not be
to restore the ban on women working underground ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : I
entirely agree, provided the circumstances were propitious.
238
[f.7]
Restoration of Ban on Women Working Underground in Coal Mines
583.
Mrs. Renuka Ray : Will the Honourable the Labour Member please state:
(a)
when the Government of India intend to restore the ban on women working underground in
coal mines in view of their former promise; and
(b)
how far the employment of women underground has increased coal raisings?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
(a) The Government are most anxious to re-impose the ban as soon as production of coal
reaches a figure which makes possible such re-imposition.
(b)
Coal raisings have increased appreciably as a result of the employment of women
underground, but no exact figures can be given as other factors are in operation at the
same time.
Mrs.
Renuka Ray : Is the Honourable Member aware that a very infinitesimal proportion
represents the increased raisings helped by women working underground and does he consider
that the violation of an international code and moral convention is compensated by the
increased raisings that is due to women working in the mines even from the point of view
increased production ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
My information is to the contrary.
Mr.
Govind V. Deshmukh:
May I know what is the target of production aimed at by Government in order to restore
this ban ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar: I
am unable to say.
Mrs. Renuka Ray: Is the Honourable Member aware that
the woman acts as loader underground and the man as cutter, and so the rate of progress of
each tub is much slower because a woman cannot act as cutter, and the result is that the
man has to rest, whereas the rate would be much faster......
Mr. President (The Honourable Sir Abdul Rahim) : The
Honourable Member is making a speech.
Mrs.
Renuka Ray :
I should like to know if the Labour Member does not consider that the rate of progress of
the work per tub is much slower because women work as loaders and cannot work as cutters.
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar: I am glad to have that information, but I am passing no
opinion either on the reliability of the statement or the feasibility of the suggestion.
239
[f.8]
Post of Labour Welfare Officer for Government of India Presses
586. Maulvi Muhammad Abdul Ghani : Will the Honourable
the Labour Member be pleased to state :
(a) whether
the post of Labour Welfare Officer for the Government of India presses was advertised; if
so, when and how;
(b) whether
any selection has been made;
(c) whether
it is a fact that the post was reserved for a Muslim;
(d)
the number of persons who have been appointed as Assistant Labour Welfare Officers during
the last two years; and
(e)
what their academic qualifications are and how many of them are Muslims ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
(a) One posts of Labour Welfare Officer for the Government of India Presses has been
sanctioned and it was advertised by the Federal Public Service Commission in the approved
newspapers in June last. Applications were due to reach the office of the Commission by
the 10th July;
(b)
and (c) Yes.
(d) One
lady Assistant Welfare Adviser was appointed directly under Labour Department.
(e)
She is M.A., M. Lilt., and is a Hindu.
Prof.
N. G. Ranga: Are these officers appointed for the Central Government Presses or also for
the Provincial Government Presses ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar
: For the Central Government Presses.
240
[f.9]
Statistics re Private Newspaper Owners and Their
Employees
600.
Mr. Kailash Bihari Lall : Will the Honourable Member for Labour be pleased to state :
(a)
if the Government have obtained any statistics about the number of private newspaper
owners and the persons employed by them; and
(b)
if the answer to (a) be in the negative, do the Government propose to obtain the
statistics with a view to afford relief to such employees with regard to (i) rules of
leave, (ii) list of holidays, (iii) grades of salaries and (iv) dearness allowance ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar:
(a) No.
(b)
The Labour Investigation Committee is collecting general information regarding the terns and conditions of employees in printing
presses. The question as to what additional information should be collected and as to the
feasibility of legislating to govern the conditions of employees of newspaper
organisations will be considered in due course.
Mr. Kailash Bihari Lall : May I know if Government
can at least obtain the figures regarding Delhi Printing Press ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
I think it would be better to wait in order to know what the Labour Investigation
Committee is doing in this matter.
Mr.
Kailash Bihrari Lall: Delhi is a small area of which the Honourable Member can
get.........
Mr.
President (The Honourable Sir Abdul Rahim) : The Honourable Member is arguing. Next
question.
241
[f.10]
Extensions of Service in Government of India Press, Aligarh
601.
Qazi Muhammad Ahmad Kazmi : Will the Honourable the Labour Member be pleased to state :
(a)
whether it is a fact that extension after extension in service is allowed in many cases in
the Government of India Press, Aligarh
(b) whether it is a fact that every year the Manager of that Press recommends a tot of cases of extension to the Controller of Printing and Stationery in India;
(c)
whether it is a fact that fully trained and qualified men are available in that Press to
work in the places of these men whose extension has been recommended by the Manager and
who are on the verge of retirement;
(d)
whether it is a fact that the claims of some of the qualified men for the posts of these
retiring hands have been blocked due to these recommendations for extension in service;
and
(e)
if the answers to (a) to (d) be in the affirmative, has the Honourable Member considered
the advisability of issuing instructions to the effect that no further extension be
granted in future under any circumstances ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : (a) and (b) No. Only a few cases are recommended.
(c) In some cases qualified men are
available, in others not.
(
d) No.
(e)
Does not arise.
Qaxi
Muhammad Ahmad Kazmi : Do I
understand that the answer to part (a) of the question is in the negative, and he has not
been recommending any extensions whatsoever?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar
: I said, only a few cases are recommended.
Qazi
Muhammad Ahmad Kazmi : Has the General Manager been granting any extensions, or not ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar:
The Manager has been granting extensions.
Qazi
Muhammad Ahmad Kazmi:
May I know why these extensions are granted when qualified persons are available.
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
I am not prepared to admit that extensions are granted notwithstanding that qualified
persons are available.
Qazi
Muhammad Ahmad Kazmi : I
understood the Honourable Member to say that sometimes extensions are granted even when
qualified persons are available.
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
Yes, m a very few cases.
Qazi
Muhammad Ahmad Kazmi:
May I know the reason for which extensions are granted to people even under those
circumstances ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar: I
understand that the general reason why these extensions are granted in the cases referred
to by my Honourable friend are entirely governed by the fact that some people tose their
pensions if they are not given a year or two's extension.
Qazi
Muhammad Ahmad Kaxmi : Is that the only reason, or is there some other reason also ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : I
am not aware of any other reason.
Qazi
Muhammad Ahmad Kazmi :
Will the Honourable Member be pleased to enquire whether the extensions that were given in
the cases referred to were solely for this reason or for some other reason ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : I
have made enquiries and that is the information I have.
Maulvi
Muhammad Abdul Ghani: May I know the names of persons included in those ' few cases ' ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar
: I have no names of persons, but I have a
certain number of cases before me.
Maulvi
Muhammad Abdul Ghani: What community do they belong to ? (No reply).
Mr.
President (The Honourable Sir Abdul Rahim) : Next question.
242
[f.11]
Time Scale of Pay for Binders and Warehousemen of
Government of India Press, New Delhi
602.
Qazi Muhammad Ahmad Kazmi : Will the Honourable the Labour Member be pleased to slate :
(a) whether it is a fact that the Government of India has sanctioned the Time Scale of pay
for which the Binders and warehousemen
of the Government of India Press, New Delhi, had been representing;
(b)
whether it is a fact that these people have been representing their case for this purpose
for the last fifteen years approximately;
(c)
whether it is a fact that some warehousemen who have been serving for the last fifteen and
twenty years and whose pay is only Rs. 25 per month at present, are not benefited at all
by this Time Scale of pay at present;
(d)
whether it is a fact that not a single increment has been sanctioned to any man,
immediately; and
(e)
if the answers to (a) to (d) be in the affirmative, will the Honourable Member please
consider the advisability of sanctioning at least one increment to all Binders and
warehousemen just at the time of introducing the Time Scale of pay so that some immediate
relief may be gained by these men who have been waiting for the last so many years ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar:
(a) Yes.
(b)
Yes, for some time past.
(c)
Yes, but they will be benefited as soon as they earn their next increment.
(d)
Yes, because no increment has been yet earned since the 22nd June 1944 when the Time Scale
came into force.
(e)
No action as proposed is necessary, as the men will earn their increments next year.
Qazi
Muhammad Ahmad Kaxmi :
Will the Honourable Member be pleased to consider that some persons will be on the verge
of retirement and will not be able to get any benefit from this time-scale. Isn't it
proper in such case for the Government to give them some increment in lieu of their past
services ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : I do not think it is prudent to alter the law in order to
meet hard cases !
243
[f.12]
Development of Mahanadi Projects in Orissa
607. Prof. N.
G. Ranga : Will the Honourable the Labour Member be pleased to state :
(a)
if he is aware that Sir M. Visweewaraya Committee's report on Mahanadi to stop the ravages
of floods in Orissa has suggested the development of Mahanadi projects and a system of
irrigation canals to irrigate huge areas of land in Cuttack, Sambalpore, Puri and Balasore
Districts;
(b)
if such a scheme was estimated to cost about rupees four crores in 1938-39; and
(c)
whether Government of India will consider the advisability of taking the initiative and
developing that scheme, in view of the financial disabilities of the subvention province
of Orissa and also of the great need of India for more rice production ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
(a) and (b) No. Information on the subject has been called for.
(c)
Government cannot give such an assurance at this stage without a careful examination of
the scheme.
Prof. N. G.
Ranga : Is Government prepared to examine this scheme carefully?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar:
Yes.
Prof.
N. G. Ranga :
Will it form part of the investigations of one of the various sub-committees or the
National Planning structure of committees ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
I cannot say as regards the procedure that Government should adopt. But I shall examine
the thing.
Prof.
N. G. Ranga:
Thank you.
244
[f.13]
Arrangements for Supply of Rice to Colliery Labour
in Bihar
611.
Mr. K. C. Neogy : (a) Will the Honourable
Member for Labour be pleased to explain in detail the arrangements that are in operation
in the province of Bihar in the matter of supplying rice to colliery labour ?
(b)
Has the Honourable Member received any complaint that the Bihar authorities are charging
some of the collieries prices for rice to be supplied to their labour force which are
higher than the control prices and that the quality of rice supplies is also bad ? If so,
what are the different points raised in these complaints, and what are the ascertained
facts relating thereto ?
(c)
How does the system in Bihar in the matter differ from the system introduced in the Bengal
collieries ?
(d)
What action do Government propose to take to remove the complaints made on behalf of a
section of the Bihar collieries in this matter ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
(a) Under an order issued by the Additional Deputy Commissioner, Dhanbad, under the
Defence of India Rules dated the 20th April 1944, every colliery worker is entitled to buy
from the colliery shop at prices equal to the controlled prices fixed by the Additional
Deputy Commissioner, an amount of foodgrains not exceeding a total of four seers of
foodgrains per week (of which not more than two seers shall be rice) for himself and each
adult dependent, and two seers (of which not more than one seer shall be rice) for each
minor dependent. In additional every heavy worker is entitled to half a seer of free
ration in rice for each attendance; but miners who prefer may draw the whole or some part
of the free ration in other grains.
(b)
The reply to the first part is in the affirmative. The facts are that the Bihar Government
have charged the Colliery Associations the actual cost of rice supplied up to the 1st
November 1944. The bulk of these supplies originated in Nepal where the Bihar government
had to purchase above their control rate. Consequently supplies of Nepal rice have been
made to the Colliery Associations at approximately Rs. 1-8-0 above the total wholesale
control rate. From the 1st November 1944, the Bihar Government have decided to charge the
total wholesale control rate plus four annas administrative charge and to bear the
resulting toss. The facts relating to the complaint regarding quality are being ascertain.
(c) In the Bengal collieries there is no rationing
system but employers of more than 1,000 workers must buy their supplies of grains from the
Civil Supplies Department of the Government. In Bihar every colliery is required to buy
through the Rice Administrator, Indian Mining Association or the Secretary Joint Supply
Pool.
(d)
The Honourable Member's attention is invited to the answer given to clause (b) of the
question.
245
[f.14]
Contract for Construction of Clerks' Quarters at Todi Road, Delhi
612. Shri K. B. Jinaraja Hegde : Will the Honourable
the Labour Member be pleased to state :
(a)
whether the contract for the construction of clerks' quarters at Todi Road for about Rs.
28,60,000 was given to a higher tenderer instead of lower tenderer who quoted 11.25 below
the schedule of rates;
(b)
if the answer to (a) is in the affirmative what was the total excess amount the Government
had to pay over the lowest tenderer;
(c)
if it is a fact that the same firm was given another contract for a similar construction
at the very place for about Rs. 50,00,000 at 5 per cent. above the schedule of rates,
rejecting the lowest tenderer; and
(d)
were the above tenders examined by the Department before they were accepted ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar:
(a) No.
(b)
Does not arise.
(c)
No. A portion of the Todi Road project was given to this firm as its tender rate was low
in comparison with that of others.
(d)
The tenders were examined and accepted by the Chief Engineer, Central Public Works
Department who is the competent authority in such cases.
246
[f.15]
Prescribing Set Form of Receipt for Rent under
Delhi Rent Control Ordinance
625.
Mr. Kailash Bihari Lall : Will the Honourable the Labour Member be pleased to state if the
Government propose to prescribe a set form of receipt to be compulsorily granted by the
landlord to the tenants under the Delhi Rent Control Ordinance, 1944 ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
Government have the matter under examination.
247
[f.16]
Increase in Cost of Living in Certain Cities
100.
Mr. Badri Dutt Pande: Will the Honourable the
Labour Member please state:
(a)
if it is a fact that the living index has shown an increase in the cost of living by 182
per cent in certain cities; if not, what the fact is;
(b)
if it is a fact that the wages of Railway servants working in those cities have not been
raised by 182 per cent; if not, what the correct fact is; and
(c)
if the Government propose to increase the wages of the employees in those cities where the
cost of living has arisen by 182 per cent accordingly; if not, why not;
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
(a) Government are aware that the published cost of living indexes have risen in some
towns by 182 or more over the index of August, 1939.
(b)
The answer to the first part is in the affirmative. In regard to the second, Railway
workers are compensated for increased cost of living by relief in cash and concessions in
kind which together are considered adequate to meet the needs and are adjusted from time
to time as the situation demands.
(c) The answer to the first part is in the
negative. As regards the second part, the policy of Government is not to make any
comprehensive revisions in scales of pay during the present unstable economic conditions
but to meet increases in the cost of living either by dearness allowance or by relief in
kind or by both.
248
[f.17]
Requests for Adjudication of Railway Trade Disputes
101.
Mr. Badri Dutt Pande: Will the Honourable the
Labour Member please state:
(a) the
number of requests for adjudication of trade disputes between the Railway Administrations
and its employees recorded during the preceding five years; and
(b) how
those requests were disposed of?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
(a) and (b). I place on the table a statement showing the number of requests made for
settlement of trade disputes between Railway Administrations and their employees during
the past five years under the Trade Disputes Act or Rule 81A of the Defence of India
Rules, and action taken on them.
249
[f.18]
Procedure re Appointment of Adjudicator of Trade
Disputes
102.
Mr. Badri Dutt Pande: Will the Honourable the
Labour Member please state:
(a)
the rules governing the proceedings before an adjudicator is appointed under Rule 81 of
the Defence of India Act Rules;
(b) the
qualifications prescribed for the appointment of an adjudicator for the trade disputes
between the employer and its employees; and
Requests
for Boards of Conciliation or Courts of Enquiry under the Trade Disputes Act or
adjudication under Defence of India Rule 81A in connection with trade dispute between the
Railway Administrations and their employees
S.
No. |
Year |
From
whom the request was received |
Nature
of request |
Action
taken |
1 |
2 |
3 |
4 |
5 |
1 |
1939 |
Certain
travelling Ticket
Inspectors on
the E. I. Rly. |
Appointment
of a Court of Enquiry under
section 3 of the Trade Disputes Act
to consider the propriety of withholding a memorial addressed to His Excellency the
Viceroy. |
Rejected
(The Trade Dispute Act did not apply as
the matter was not a trade
dispute for the purpose of the Act). |
2 |
1940 |
The
employees of the
G.I.P. Railway. |
Appointment
of a Court of Enquiry Under
section 3 of the Trade Disputes Act
to investigate the question of Grant
of war dearness allowance. |
Accepted. |
3 |
1943 |
All
India Railwaymen's Federation, Mylapore,
Madras. |
Appointment
of an adjudicator Under
Defence of India Rule 81A on the
question of dearness allowance for Railway. |
Rejected. |
4 |
1943 |
The
G.I.P. Railwaymen's Union, Bombay. |
Do. |
Do. |
5 |
1944 |
The
N.W.R. Employee
Union, Karachi. |
Do. |
Do. |
6 |
1944 |
G.I.P.Railwaymen's
Union. |
Do. |
Do. |
7 |
1944 |
B.B.
& C.I. Railwaymen's Union, Bombay. |
Do. |
Under
consideration of Government. |
See question no.101 at Sr. No.249
(c) on
whose report or request an adjudicator under Rule 81 of the Defence of India Act Rules is
to be appointed ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar:
(a) The Honourable Member is presumably referring to rule 81A of the Defence of India
Rules. There are no rules governing the proceedings before an adjudicator.
(b)
No qualifications have been prescribed and it is not possible to do so because action
under Rule 81A is of an urgent nature and it is not always possible readily to obtain
persons of any particular qualifications in different parts of the country. The general
rule is to appoint the most suitable person available in all circumstances of the case.
Persons so far appointed include High Court Judges, District and Sessions Judges, Chief
Presidency Magistrates, Labour Commissioners and their Assistants, Workmen Compensation
Commissioners and War Injuries Claims Officers.
(c)
An adjudicator may be appointed at the request of either or both the parties, or on the
initiative of Government.
250
[f.19]
Results of Propaganda by Indian Labour Federation
103.
Mr. Badri Dutt Pande: Will the Honourable the
Labour Member please state the results achieved from the propaganda by the Federation of
Labour from the subsidy of Rs. 13,000 a month ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar: I would refer the Honourable Member to the reply
given by me on the 7th November 1944 to part (c) of Prof. Ranga's starred question No.
152.
251
[f.20]
Appointment
of Committee of Enquiry re Mica Industry of
India
Mr.
Satya Narayan Sinha : (a) Will the Honourable the Labour Member be pleased to state if it
is a fact that a Committee of Enquiry by the Central Government regarding Mica Industry of
Bihar has been appointed or is going to be appointed.
(b) Is the Honourable Member aware that a
constitution of the said enquiry is beyond the jurisdiction of the Federal Legislative
list ?
(c)
If the reply be in the affirmative will the Honourable Member be pleased to state the
reason for such encroachment upon the Provincial Legislative List as set out in the
Seventh Schedule to the Government of India Act, 1935.
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar:
(a) Yes, the Committee has been appointed.
(b)
and (c) In appointing the Committee the Central Government proceeded on the view that no
such encroachment was involved, but the Honourable Member is of course free to form his
own opinion.
Mr.
Satya Narayan Sinha : Will the Honourable Member please state under what section of the
Government of India Act has the action been taken ?
Mr. President (The Honourable Sir Abdul Rahim):
Presumably Government have acted upon their own responsibility.
252
[f.21]
Summary of Proceedings of the Fifth Labour Conference and the Fourth Meeting of the
Standing Labour Committee
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar
(Labour Member) : Sir, I lay on the table a copy each of the Summary of Proceedings of the
Fifth Labour Conference held at New Delhi on the 6th and 7th September 1943 and the Fourth
Meeting of the Standing Labour Committee held at Lucknow on the 25th and 26th January
1944.
253
[f.22]
Government Contribution to Indian Labour Federation
35.
Mr. Lalchand Navalrai : (a) Will the Honourable the Labour Member be pleased to state if
his attention has been drawn to a contribution by the United Press, published in the Sind
Observer of the
17th
December, 1944, under the caption " Roy-Mchta Mud Slinging over Rs.13,000 in which
Mr. Jamnadas Mehta, M.L.A., now an officer in the Government of India, has said that he
has with him an official correspondence on the aforesaid subject showing that the name of
the Labour Federation has been used behind the back, over the head and without the
knowledge of either its President or its Executive Council and further Rs. 13,000 per
month were obtained by Mr. Roy for himself to be used as he liked ?
(b)
In view of the above information, will the Honourable Member be pleased to give
information with regard to this public money as to whom it was given and for what purpose,
and how it was used, and did Mr. Roy himself use the money as he liked, or did he make use
of it for his own purposes or divide it with Mr. Jamnadas Mehta ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar:
(a) Yes, by the Honourable Member himself.
(b)
I would invite attention to my reply given to the Honourable Member's question No. 31 on
the 2nd November, 1944.
Mr. Lalchand Navalrai : The Honourable Member has not
given specific replies to my questions. I want to know, with regard to part (b), whether
what Mr. Jamnadas Mehta has said in that article is correct, or what the Honourable Member
said last lime on this question was correct ? Is this money for Mr. Jamnadas, is it for
Mr. Roy, or is it for both ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
I have nothing to add to the reply that I have given.
Mr. Lalchand Navalrai : But I want the Honourable
Member to reply to my questions.
Mr.
President (The Honourable Sir Abdul Rahim) : The Honourable Member has given the reply.
Mr. Lalchand Navalrai : I know that the Honourable
Member is feeling shy over this question because if he makes a statement it would go
against his own answers. I submit that the Honourable Member should reply to my questions
otherwise there will be an adjournment motion on this subject.
Dr. Sir Zia Uddin Ahmad: I think the House has got
a right to know whether it is a personal gratuity or it is for the benefit of the
Federation.
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar:
It is given to the Federation.
Mr.
T. S. Avinashilingam Chettiar : May I know whether the Government has satisfied themselves
that it has been entered in the accounts of the Federation and it has been spent through
the Federation ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar: Yes.
Mr.
T. S. Avinashilingam Chettiar : May I know whether the Government are contemplating an
increased amount being given ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar: No.
Mr.
T. S. Avinashilingam Chettiar : May I know for what period this has been sanctioned for
the present ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : It is sanctioned for a year.
Mr.
T. S. Avinashilingam Chettiar : May I know when it ends ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar: When the budget ends.
Mr.
Badri Dutt Pande: The Honourable Member said the other day that audited copies of accounts
will be placed on the table of the House. Has he done so ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar:
They have not been received as yet.
Mr. Govind V. Deshmukh : Has the Honourable Member
seen the details of this account ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : I
understand that they are seen by a special officer who has been appointed by Government in
this behalf.
Mr. Lalchand Navalrai : From those accounts that the
Honourable Member has seen already, is it or is it not clear that this money has been
utilised by Mr. Roy for his own purposes ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar:
I think that is not the correct statement.
Mr. Lalchand Navalrai : Then which is the correct
statement ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : It
has been spent for the purposes for which it has been granted.
Mr.
Badri Dutt Pande: To whom was the money handed over to Mr. Roy, to Mr. Jamnadas Mehta, or
to the Secretary of the Federation ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar:
It is received by the Secretary of the Federation.
Mr.
Jamnadas M. Mehta : No money has been received by the Federation from the Government. The
Name of the Federation has been used behind the back, over the head and without the
knowledge of either its Executive Committee or its President. The Government have been
cheated. It is without the knowledge of the Federation.
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : It is not my information.
Mr.
Jamnadas M. Mehta : Government have been cheated.
Mr.
Lalchand Navalrai : Will the Government take any action now that the Honourable Member has
been told that Government has been cheated ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar: Government does
not believe that it has been cheated.
254
[f.23]
Re-Imposition of Ban on Women Working Underground in Mines
48.
Mr. T. S. Avinashilingain Chettiar : Will the Honourable the Labour Member please state :
(a)
whether the matter of continuing to allow women inside the mines has been reviewed ;
(b)how
many women are now working under mines ; and (c) in view of the fact that women working
underneath cannot even decently clothe themselves, whether he will consider the
advisability of abolishing the practice altogether ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : (a) The question of re-imposing the ban on the
underground employment of women in coal mines, to which the Honourable Member presumably
refers, has been reviewed.
(b)
The figure varies but at present about 15,000 to 16,000 women are employed underground in
coal mines.
(c) The ban has been lifted only as a temporary
measure, and will be reimposed as soon as conditions permit.
I
may also add that all female workers, both surface and underground, are supplied with two
saries per year at the concessional rates as arranged for by the various Mining
Associations; at some mines the saries are given free and at others at half price.
Mr.
T. S. Avinashilingam Chettiar : The question was not whether they get saris to wear. It is
impossible for them to wear the saris in the mines and so the question of presentation of
saris or giving them at concessional rates is absolutely irrelevant. I understand that
they cannot wear saris above the waist line while working in the mines, because it is too
wrong.
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar: It is quite wrong.
Mr.
T. S. Avinashilingam Chettiar: When do you expect to reimpose the ban ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
As soon as circumstances permit.
Mr.
T. S. Avinashilingam Chettiar : What are the circumstances ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar: They are not
under my control nor am I able to anticipate them.
255
[f.24]
Casualties in Coal Mines
52.
Mr. Abdul Qaiyum : Will the Honourable the
Labour Member please state:
(a)
how many people were killed or wounded while working in coal mines in 1943 and 1944 ;
(b)
whether the proposal of providing "Pit head baths " for women engaged in the
mines and creaches for their children has been given effect to ; and
(a) if
not, the reasons for the delay ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar:
Killed Injured
(a)
1943 - 290
1,320
(b)
1944 - 332
1,395
(c)
So far pit head baths have been provided only in the Digwardih Collieries; creaches have
been installed in 7 collieries of Central Provinces and in one colliery of Raniganj
(Bengal).
(d)
The Government of India are not aware of the reasons for the delay. They have under active
consideration the question of amending the Indian Mines Act to make it obligatory on the
mine owners who employ women workers to maintain creches.
Mr. Abdul Qaiyum : Will the Government see that these
improvements are effected in good time before the ban on employment of women takes place ?
Otherwise,
there will be no use for these improvements later on ? Will the Honourable Member see that
they are not delayed too long ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
Employment of women underground may be stopped but employment of women on the surface will
continue. Creaches will be necessary. That does not mean that I am going to delay matters.
Prof.
N. G. Ranga : How many of those cases reported killed, due to mining accidents, were women
?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar: I want notice.
Pandit
Lakshmi Kanta Maitra : What percentage of these deaths was due to asphyxiation and what
percentage was due to accidents.
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : I want notice.
256
[f.25]Mineral
Deposits in South India
61.
Mr. K. S. Gupta : (a) Will the Honourable the Labour
Member please state the different types of mineral deposits—metallic and
non-metallic—found in South India as a result of the occasional survey done by the
Geological Department during the past thirty years ?
(b)
Is it a fact that deposits of magnetic iron ore are found in large quantities in easily
accessible places ?
(c)
Was there any attempt made by the Government of India to establish an iron and steel
industry or encourage others to establish one in the vicinity of these deposits ? If not,
why not ?
(d) Was there any systematic examination and
investigation of the following deposits in the Madras Province (i) copper, (ii) zinc,
(iii) lead, and (iv) aluminium? If so, what are the results ?
(e)
Is it not a fact that ceramic articles of high quality could be manufactured in the
Province of Madras if the resources are properly tapped ? Are there any investigations
made with regard to this industry ? If not, why not ?
(f)
Is it not a fact that Illuminate, an important mineral for manufacture of paint, could be
found in some of the Southern districts ? Was there any scheme or attempt made to develop
this industry ? If not, why not ?
(g)
Is it not a fact that large quantities of mica, an irreplaceable mineral for high tension
electrical work, is found in some of the coastal districts of the Madras Province ?
(h)
Is it not a fact that mica is simply mined and exported to foreign countries without any
attempt to start an industry for the preparation of electrical goods ?
(i)
Do the Government of India propose to establish in Southern India a central research
organisation to study these deposits ? If so, when ? If not, why not ?
(j)
Is it not a fact that almost all the scientific research institutions started and to be
started under the Bureau of Scientific and Industrial Research would be located in
Northern India ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
(a) Metallic : Chromite, iron ores, ilmenite and Columbite-Tentalite.
Non-Metallic:
Ceramic materials including Kaolin, Fireclay and other types of clays, quartz, felspar,
and sillimanite. Coal Lignite, and Rare Earth Minerals including Monazite, Zircon and
Samarskite.
(b)
Yes.
(c)
No. The ore is low grade and is not associated with suitable fuel for smelting.
(d)
Yes. No deposits of economic value have however been discovered by the Geological Survey.
(e)
Possibly. The Madras Government have given attention to this question and have employed
Ceramic Experts.
The
Geological Survey is conducting investigations on the quantity and quality of ceramic
materials in Madras.
(f)First
part. Yes. Second part. No, because the deposits in Travan-core are much richer than those
in Madras, and the demand for this mineral is limited.
(g)
Yes.
(h)
Yes, mica is largely exported.
(i)The Government of India have under
consideration a scheme of expansion of the Geological Survey of India, both in personnel
and in activities; it is hoped that in future a much more intensive study of the mineral
deposits in the country would be possible than is the case at present.
(j)
The question should be addressed to the appropriate Member.
257
[f.26]
Damodar Canal and Polavaram Projects
65.
Prof. N. G. Ranga : Will the Honourable the Labour Member be pleased to state :
(a)
whether, in view of his references to the Tennessey Valley Authority as a model after
which the Damodar Canal (Bengal) and Polavaram (Madras) projects are to be developed.
Government would be pleased to get a brief report published about the general aspects of
that scheme and its achievements ;
(b)
whether, in view of the special need of Bengal for relief from floods, flood-relief will
be accepted as the primary objective of the proposed Damodar project ; and
(c)
whether, in view of the great need of scheduled classes (Harijans) of Bengal and Bihar for
lands, the Government of India will take special steps to set aside adequate funds for
obtaining large areas of lands for co-operative settlement and cultivation by the Harijans
of Bengal and Bihar ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
(a) The Tennessey Valley Authority is a foreign Government organisation. A copy of the
report on the working of the Authority will be obtained and placed in the library of the
House.
(b) Yes ; flood-control will receive priority over
other aspects of control measures.
(c)
The problem of the best way of helping landless labourers is engaging the attention of
Government.
258
[f.27]
Higher Prices Charged for Rice in Bihar Coalfields
72.
Mr. K. C. Neogy : (a) Will the Honourable the Labour Member be pleased to state whether it
is a fact that, in spite of his reply to my starred question No. 611(b) on the 20th
November, 1944, that the Bihar Government have decided to charge the total wholesale
controlled rate plus four annas administrative charge and to bear the resulting toss, the
Joint Pool at Jharia is continuing to charge the old rate from its members ?
(b)
Is it a fact that some mine-owners have lodged protest with the Central Government on this
question ? If so, what steps have been taken to redress their grievances ?
(c)
Is it a fact that the General Manager of a large colliery in the Province of Bihar has
been committed to the Court of Session by the Magistrate, Dhanbad, to stand his trial
under Section 81 of the Defence of India Rules at the instance of the Rationing Officer,
Dhanbad, for supply of rice to the miners in excess of the prescribed ratio for the
purpose of increasing the output of coal at his colliery ?
(d)
Is it a fact that the Rationing Officer, Dhanbad, himself on behalf of the Bihar
Government was charging and allowing the Joint Pool to charge higher rates over the
declared controlled rates during the same period, as admitted by the Honourable Member in
reply to my above question ?
(e)
Will Government consider the desirability of taking necessary steps against the said
Rationing Officer, Dhanbad, for violating the rules promulgated under the Ordinance, dated
the 9th February, 1944, issued by the Deputy Commissioner, Dhanbad, by charging higher
rates than the controlled rates of rice ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
(a) and (b) The Bihar Government report that they have received no protest to this effect
but I have received one and have asked the Bihar Government for a further report. The
matter will be further considered on receipt of their report.
(c)
Yes.
(d) Collieries
were being charged in excess of control rates for foodgrains prior to November, 1944,
under the orders of the Provincial Government.
(e)
Does not arise in view of reply to part (d).
259
[f.28]
Purchasing of Delhi Electric Supply and Traction Company
76.
Mr. K. C. Neogy : (a) Will the Honourable the Labour Member be pleased to refer to his
reply to my starred question No. 419 on the 15th November, 1944 and state whether any
decision has been arrived at in regard to the question of the Government exercising their
option to purchase the Delhi Electric Supply and Traction Company, Limited, on the expiry
of their present licence ?
(b)
If it has been decided to exercise this option, has the required notice been served on the
Company ?
(c)
In the event of the undertaking being taken over by Government, what will be the machinery
for running it in future ?
(d)
In case it has been decided not to exercise the aforesaid option, will the Honourable
Member be pleased to make a detailed statement of the reasons for such decision ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
(a) and (b). It is understood that the Chief Commissioner has decided to serve a notice on
the Company of the intention of Government to exercise their option to purchase, but that
the notice has not yet been served.
(c) No decision has yet been taken.
(d)
Does not arise.
260
[f.29]
Recent Racial and Religious Distinction set up by Labour Department about Allotment of
Quarters
Mr. President (The Honourable Sir Abdul Rahim) : The
next notice of an adjournment motion is from Sir Syed Raza Ali to censure the Government
of India for the racial and religious distinction recently set up by the Labour Department
in the allotment of houses in favour of Europeans, Anglo-Indians and Indian Christians by
issuing Memorandum No. WII-4/114, dated 25th January, 1945.
I
should like to know from the Member in charge what exactly the position is.
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar
(Labour Member) : Sir, I have looked into the Memorandum and I am told that instead of the
word " Indian " the word " Indian Christians " crept in through
inadvertence. It will be corrected so that there will be no discrimination involved at
all.
Sir
Syed Raxa Ali (Cities of the United Provinces :
Muhammadan Urban) : I think the best thing would be for the Honourable Member to make a
statement in this House and have the whole thing placed on record.
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : I
have corrected the Office Memorandum and it will be issued in the altered form.
Sir
Syed Raza Ali : But the House would like to know something as to what is being talked
about. What is the meaning of the Memorandum as it stands and what is the correction that
my Honourable friend has made and what will be the effect of the correction.
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
The Memorandum that was originally issued read as follows:
"
This Department has had under consideration the question of the abolition of the
distinction between ' Orthodox ' and ' Unorthodox ' types of quarters available in Delhi,
New Delhi and Simla for allotment to officers drawing less than Rs. 600 per mensern. After
considering the views of the Departments, it has been decided that the distinction should
be abolished with effect from the next summer season.
In
respect of Europeans, Anglo-Indians and Indian Christians, in whose case the Estate
Officer is satisfied that they profess European habits, the Estate Officer has been vested
with discretion to allot residence with raised W. C. (unorthodox quarters) to them
provided they are otherwise eligible for the particular category of 'A', 'B', 'C' and 'D'
type of accommodation."
Necessary
amendments to the rules will be made in due course. That was the original Memorandum that
was issued. The amended Memorandum makes this change.
"The
Estate Officer has been vested with discretion to allot residences with raised W. C.
(unorlhodox quarters) to those officers, whether European, Anglo-Indian or Indian, in
whose case he is satisfied that they profess European habits, provided they are otherwise
eligible for the particular categories of "A", "B", "C" and
"D".
261
[f.30]
Ignoring Claims of Central Assembly Members for Accommodation in Western Court Rooms
156.
Mr. Abdul Qaiyum: Will the Honourable the Labour Member please slate:
(a)
Whether certain rooms in the Western Court and other accommodation are primarily intended
for the Honourable Members of the Central Assembly attending the Sessions or Select
Committees.
(b)
whether in allotting accommodation for the Select Committee on the Insurance Bill, the
claims of the Members have been ignored and the Members of the National Defence Council
have been given preference ; and, if so, why ; and
(c)
whether due regard to the prior claims of the Members of the Central Legislative Assembly
will be paid in future ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
(a) 19 rooms in the Western Court and 69 quarters are reserved for the Honourable Members
of the Indian Legislature during the sessions. During the non-Session periods, 7 rooms in
the Western Court and 8 quarters are reserved for Members visiting Delhi in connection
with the work of the Central Legislature.
(b)
No; the rooms in the Western Court were allotted to the Members of the National Defence
Council in the absence of any intimation of the meeting of the Select Committee on the
Insurance Bill in January, 1945 or of any demand for accommodation from the Members.
Arrangement was however made to accommodate the members of the Select Committee who asked
for accommodation in the Western Court.
(c)
Arrangement is always made to accommodate the Members of the Central Legislature provided
timely notice is given.
262
[f.31]
Construction of a Road to Imperial Research Institute at Mukteswar
178.
Mr. Badri Dutt Pande : (a) Will the Honourable the Labour Member be pleased to state if
there is a proposal to construct a cart or motor road to the Imperial Researeh Institute
at Mukteswar in the Naini Tal district ?
(b)
If so, what will be the length of the road and the cost of construction ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar: (a) There is no such proposal before this Government.
(b)
Does not arise.
263
[f.32]
Examination of Commercial Aspects of Indian Spring-waters
308.
Mr. K. C. Neogy : (a) Will the Honourable the Labour member be pleased to refer to
unstarred question No. 50 of the 5th August, 1943, and the reply thereto, and make a
statement indicating the results of the examination of the commercial aspects of Indian
spring-waters, and the trial given thereto, the location of the different springs where
trials have been made and the composition and properties of the respective waters ?
(b)Have Government any scheme for the working of
any of these sources of spring-water through State agency or through the agency of any
private enterprise ? If so, what are the details of such schemes ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
(a) and (b). Waters of certain thermal mineral springs in Bihar were investigated by the
Geological Survey of India and after examination of the chemical properties of these
waters it was decided that there would be no advantage in Government undertaking during
war time the commercial exploitation of these waters.
264
[f.33]
Damodar River Transport for Coal in Bengal
310.
Mr. R. R. Gupta : Is the Honourable the Labour
Member aware that in the last century a proposal was considered by the Government of India
for providing river transport to the movement of coal from the Bengal coal fields to
Calcutta by rendering the river Damodar as an all weather navigable channel ? If not, will
Government consider the advisability of re-examining such a proposal in connection with
the proposed multi-purpose Damodar River project ? If not, why not?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : I
am not aware of any such proposal but there was a proposal to take out a canal from the
Damodar river from Raniganj to Calcutta.
The
enquiry now being made is examining the possibility of a multipurpose scheme for the
control of the Damodar—this examination will extend to the possibilities of
encouraging navigation.
265
[f.34]
Discovery of Petroleum Near Rawalpindi
314.
Mr. T. T. Krishnamachari : Will the Honourable the Labour Member please state:
(a)
whether his attention has been drawn to the reports appearing in the newspapers about the
discovery of petroleum near Rawalpindi and the Punjab ; and
(b)whether
the monopoly for exploiting this petroleum has been given to a foreign concern ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
(a) Yes, Government have seen the reports referred to— (b) The matter is the concern
of the Provincial Government and Government of India have no information.
266
[f.35]
Women Workers in Mills and Factories of Delhi Province
327.
Shrimati K. Radha Bai Subbarayan : Will the Honourable the Labour Member please state :
(a)
the total number of women workers in the year, 1944, in the mills and factories in Delhi
Province to which the Factories Act is applied;
(b)
whether action under the Factories Act was taken against any of these concerns for failure
to conform to the provisions of Acts for safeguarding the interests of women workers ; and
(c) whether
a Women Labour Welfare Officer has been appointed for Delhi Province ; and, if so, what
her duties are ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
With your permission. Sir, I propose to reply together to question Nos. 327 and 328. I
have made enquiries and will lay a report on the table in due course.
267
[f.36]
Delhi Electric Supply and Traction Company
403.
Mr. T. S. Avinashilingam Chettiar : Will the Honourable the Labour Member please state :
(a) whether
he has completed the enquiry promised by him in his answer to Mr. Neogy's question No. 419
in the last session regarding the Delhi Electric Supply and Traction Company ;
(b) the
profit the company is making; and
(c)
the result of the enquiries, and whether Government propose exercising the option to
purchase it ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
(a) and (c). The Honourable Member's attention is drawn to the reply given to Mr. K. C.
Neogy's question on 9th February 1945.
(b)The
dividend declared by the Company since 1939 has been as follows: 1939—11 per cent. }
1940—11 percent. }
1941—11 per cent. }- income tax
free.
1942— 9 per cent. }
1943— 9 per cent. }—
Mr.
T. S. Avinashilingam Chettiar : Have Government decided to take over the Company ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : Yes, Sir.
Mr.
T. S. Avinashilingam Chettiar: When will it come into effect ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar: As soon as the license ends.
Mr.
K. C. Neogy : Has the notice been actually served as yet?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : I believe so.
268
[f.37]
Government Contribution to Indian Labour Federation
404.
Mr. T. S. Avinashilingam Chettiar : Will the Honourable the Labour Member please slate :
(a)
whether, in view of the fact that the President of the Trade Union Congress, Sri Jamnadas
Mehta, has denied the fact of having received the amount from the Government as alleged by
the Labour Member, he has investigated into the matter;
(b)
whether the amount has been credited in the accounts of the Trade Union Congress ; and
(c)
in whose hands the money is being given ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
The Honourable Member is apparently referring in this question to Indian Federation of
Labour of which Mr. Mehta was the President and not to the All-India Trade Union Congress.
(a)
I would refer the Honourable Member to my reply to Mr. Lalchand Navalrai's question No. 31
on the 2nd November, 1944. (b) I have no knowledge.
(c)
The payment was originally made to the representatives of the Federation through the
National War Front and later, through the Chairmen, National Service Labour Tribunals.
From June 1944, the payment is made to the Secretary of the Federation.
Mr.
T. S. Avinashilingam Chettiar : Is it not necessary that Government should satisfy
themselves that when money is sanctioned for a particular organisation it has been
credited to the accounts of that organisation ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
It is not my business to check the accounts of any organisation.
Mr.
T. S. Avinashilingam Chettiar : In view of the Honourable Member's statement on a previous
occasion that an auditor had been sent to audit the accounts may I know if the auditor's
report has been received ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar
: My Honourable friend must put down a specific question on that point.
Mr. Abdul Qaiyum : Will the Honourable Member give
the names of the office-bearers of the organisation who actually received the money ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
First of all it was paid through the National War Front; then a change was made and the
money was paid through the Chairmen of the National Labour Service Tribunals; and from
June, 1944 it is paid to the Secretary of the Federation.
Mr. Abdul Qaiyum : Will the Honourable Member give
the name of the particular gentleman who received the money ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
I shall require notice.
Mr.
T. S. Avinashilingam Chettiar :
In view of the fact that the Public Accounts Committee for 1942-43 specifically said that
no vouchers and no accounts are kept for this money given to Mr. Roy, may I know if the
money was given to Mr. Roy in his personal name and whether audits were made and what
conclusion the auditors came to as to whether the amounts were credited to the
organisation ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : I
cannot say to whom the money was paid before the new arrangement was made. After the new
arrangement was made the money is paid to the person who is known as Secretary.
Mr. Badri Dutt Pande : In view of the fact that the
subsidy to the Labour Federation is not approved by this House, is it the intention of
Government to discontinue it ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
I do not wish to anticipate the decision.
Mr.
T. S. Avinashilingam Chettiar : Has provision been made for it in the next Budget ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
If my Honourable friend will wait he will know.
Mr. Sri Prakasa : Have Government made sure that the
money is well spent ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : Yes sir. I have
no doubt about it.
Mr.
T. S. Avinashilingam Chettiar :
Sir, may I point out to the Chair that this is an impertinent answer ? The Budget is
coming up soon and he must know whether provision for this amount has been made. May I
know whether this sum has been provided for ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
My Honourable friend will know it on the 28th February.
269
[f.38]
Labour Exchange Bureaus
405. Mr. T. S.
Avinashilingam Chettiar : (a) Will the Honourable the Labour Member please state in
how many places labour exchange bureaus have been established ?
(b) For what class of persons are these bureaus
intended to serve ?
(c) Till now, for how many persons have they found
employment ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
(a) Employment Exchanges have been established at ten centres in India, viz., Bombay, Ahmedabad, Nagpur, Madras,
Calcutta, Dhanbad, Cawnpore, Delhi, Lahore and Karachi.
(b)
for the present, the Employment Exchanges are intended to serve technical personnel as
defined under the National Service (Technical,) Personnel Ordinance, 1940 who are in
receipt of wages of not less than Rs. 1-8-0 per day in the cities of Bombay and Calcutta
and Re. I per day in other places.
(c)
Upto 31st December, 1944 the Exchanges had found employment for 5,909 workmen.
I
may add that it was only in December, 1943 that it was decided to set up these exchanges
and considerable difficulty was experienced in securing competent staff and suitable
accommodation.
Mr.
T. S. Avinashilingam Chettiar : May I know whether Government propose to extend the work
of these Labour Exchanges to other categories of labour ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : Yes, Sir.
Mr.
T. S. Avinashilingam Chettiar : What are these other categories of labour which extension
is proposed ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
We have come to no decision as yet.
Mr.
Abdul Qaiyum : May I know for what percentage of the total applicants jobs were found ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : The total number of workmen that were registered as
wanting jobs was 14,697 out of whom employment was found for 5,909 men.
Shrimati
Radha Bai Subbarayan : Do these figures include women also?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : My figures do not make any distinction between male and
female.
270
[f.39]
Arrangements for Care of Children of Women Miners
436. Shrimati K. Radha Bai Subbarayan : Will the
Honourable the Labour Member please state :
(a)
what the specific arrangements are for the care of infants and children of women miners
working inside mines and on the surface in all mining areas, and under whose supervision
these arrangements are carried out;
(b)
the facilities provided for nursing mothers working inside mines to feed their infants at
regular intervals ; and
(c)
whether the arrangements referred to in (a) and (b) have been approved by any medical
authority ; and, if so, by whom ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
(a) No specific arrangements have so far been made, but at a few mines crèches with
female attendants have been provided and in some collieries child clinics exist where milk
is distributed to miners' children. The question of requiring provision of crèches is at
present under the consideration of Government.
(b)
Children are not allowed underground and therefore no special facilities are required
underground. Mothers are not allowed underground within one month of delivery. Information
as to facilities allowed to other mothers to come up to feed their children is being
called for.
(c)
No.
Shrimati
K. Radha Bai Subbarayan : May I ask. Sir, if the Government will prohibit women from
working underground in mines where these arrangements have not been made until Government
consider this question ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : I
have not followed the question.
Shrimati
K. Radha Bai Subbarayan : Will Government take definite steps to have proper arrangements
for the care of children and for enabling women to come up to the surface to feed their
children ? Surely infants require to be fed even after they are a month old ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : I
cannot arrive at a decision until I know what is the magnitude of the problem. I have
called for information.
Shrimati
K. Radha Bai Subbarayan : As the Honourable Member himself admits that the problem is a
very serious one, will Government prohibit women from working underground till they have
finished considering the problem ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
I do not know whether there are any number of women who are suckling babies underground.
Mr.
Manu Subedar : Will the Honourable Member discontinue the work of women underground in
those mines where the crèches and other facilities mentioned by him do not exist.
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : I
am taking steps to see that every mine has got creches.
Mr.
Manu Subedar : Will the Honourable Member discontinue the work of women until that time ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
If that was the only alternative, that proposition might be considered.
Prof.
N. G. Ranga :
Will Government consult the All-India Medical Council in regard to part (c) of this
question in regard to the advisability or otherwise of allowing mothers with suckling
babies to work underground ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : I
do not know whether they will accept the responsibility of advising Government in this
matter.
Prof. N. G.
Ranga : I am asking whether Government will be willing to ask them, whether they are
prepared to give advise or not.
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar
: I do not think this is a problem where consultation is necessary.
Shrimati
K. Radha Bai Subbarayan : May I ask if the International Labour Conference during its last
session made certain suggestions with regard to this matter ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : I
have no information at all at present with me.
Mrs.
Renuka Ray : Is it a fact that these crèches in most mines only function effectively when
visitors are conducted round and when Government Inspectors go round there on their
pre-arranged visits and that miners' children who live in neighbouring areas are sometimes
not permitted into the crèches and there are no adequate facilities in most of the mines
for the care of infants or children, even where crèches exist in name with very few
exceptions ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : I
do not know how the Honourable Member knows that there are no crèches when she does not
go and visit.
Mr.
N. M. Joshi:
The Honourable Member had gone to the mining areas.
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar: I
have also gone.
271
[f.40]
Steps for Enforcing Mines Maternity Benefits Act in Mining Areas
437. Shrimati K. Radha Bai Subbarayan : Will the
Honourable the Labour Member please state :
(a)
what steps Government have taken to enforce the provisions of the Mines Maternity Benefits
Act in mining areas since women miners are illiterate and ignorant of their rights ;
(b)
whether Government have any report about the application of this Act since it was passed
in 1941 ;
(c)
whether four week's absence before and after delivery of a child has not proved
insufficient to give adequate relief to the women miners and avoid injury to their health;
and
(d)whether
Government have obtained medical opinion on the subject referred to in (c) ; and, if so,
whether Government will place a copy of it on the table of the House; and, if not whether
Government propose to take steps to secure such opinion ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
(a) One Senior Labour Inspector and two Junior Labour Inspectors who are qualified doctors
have been appointed, under the Chief Inspector of Mines in India.
(b)
Although Government themselves have not received reports about the working of the Act, the
Inspectors under the Chief Inspector of Mines submit reports to him regularly and suitable
action is taken by the Department of Mines.
(c)
and (d). The four-week period before and after delivery in respect of women is in line
with similar provision under Factory legislation. The question of increasing the period
before delivery in respect of women employed underground is under consideration.
Prof.
N. G. Ranga :
What about after delivery ? Will Government also consider the advisability of extending
the period after delivery ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
It is not necessary. There is complete prohibition on the employment of women who have
delivered.
Mrs.
Renuka Ray : Is the Honourable Member aware of the fact that since the ban on the
employment of women underground was withdrawn, there have been cases in some mines of
children being born underground.
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : I have no information.
Mrs.
Renuka Ray : Will the Honourable Member kindly find out and take steps to see that such
cases do not occur ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : If the Honourable Member will refer me to specific cases,
I shall certainly make inquiries.
Mrs.
Renuka Ray : I am prepared to do so.
Shrimati
K. Raclha Bai Subbarayan : May I ask for an assurance that Government will get the opinion
of a competent medical authority on this important question, before they come to a
decision on it ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
They will undoubtedly, if they find it necessary.
Shrimati
K. Radha Bai Subbarayan
: Is it not a fact that the International Labour Conference during its last session
suggested that the period before and after confinement should be about two months under
the Maternity Benefits Act ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : I have no information. I do not recall that.
Shrimati
K. Radha Bai Subbarayan : I
understand that it is mentioned in the report which the Government have circulated to us.
Mrs.
Renuka Ray : Since the Honourable Member considers that he is justified in ignoring the
International Convention prohibiting women working underground, I should like to know if
he thinks it also unnecessary to consider the maternity benefits provision of the
International Labour Conference ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R.
Ambedkar : We are considering that matter.
272
[f.41]
Abolition of Distinction between Orthodox and Un-Orthodox Quarters
451.
Mr. H. A. Sathar H. Essak Sait : Will the Honourable the Labour Member be pleased to state
:
(a)
the reasons that led to the decision to abolish the distinction between " orthodox
" and " un-orthodox " types of quarters as stated in the Labour Department
Memorandum, dated the 25th January, 1945; and
(b)
the effect of this decision on (i) the present occupants of such quarters and (ii) those
who qualify for these quarters in the future ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : (a) According to the allotment rules hithertho in force,
applicants for accommodation had to apply either for the orthodox or the un-orthodox type
of quarters and those who applied for one type of quarters were considered ineligible for
the other type. In view of the present shortage of accommodation, the above rules very
often worked to the disadvantage of the officers eligible for these types of
accommodation, and produced the anomalous result that if an applicant failed to secure
accommodation in the type he had applied for, he was obliged to go without any
accommodation at all, even though he might have secured accommodation in the other type,
had he applied specifically for that type.
Further,
the maintenance of the distinction between the two types of quarters entailed extra work
in the Estate Office in as much as the allotment of the two types of quarters had to be
kept separate. Besides, it was also felt that the maintenance of the distinction between
orthodox and un-orthodox quarters and their allotment on the basis of the orthodoxy or
otherwise had become out of dale.
(b)
(i) None.
(ii)
The decision of 25th January 1945 has since been slightly modified on 15th February 1945.
Those who are eligible for the particular category of ' A', 'B', ' C ' and ' D ' type of
accommodation will be eligible to apply for both types of quarters.
273
[f.42]
Deaths of Women Workers in Mines
453.
Mr. K. S. Gupta : (a) Will the Honourable the Labour
Member please state the number of deaths of women workers in the mines of India (including
coal) in the years of 1942, 1943 and 1944 due to (i) diseases, and (ii) accidents ?
(b)
Is it not a fact that men workers are not available to work in coal mines as the wages
offered are not commensurate with the rise in prices of foodstuffs and other necessaries
of life ?
(c)
Is there any attempt on the part of the mine owners or the Government of India to offer
better wages and special amenities of life in the supply of foodstuffs and housing
accommodation to mine workers to attract enough men workers to enable the Government to
apply the ban on women working underground and thus save the dignity of womanhood in India
as in every other civilised country ?
(d)
Is it not a fact that infant mortality is very high in the mining areas due to lack of
milk from the mother who is automatically getting dry due to hard and strenuous work
underground ?
(e)
Is it not a fact that no pure milk is available to the workers in the mining areas ?
(f)
.Are any attempts made by the mine-owners or Government to supply milk free of cost to
children at least below one year in the various mining areas ? If not, why not ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
(a) The number of deaths of women in all mines in India due to accidents both on surface
and underground for the years 1942, 1943 and 1944 were 9, 11 and 53 respectively. No
figures of deaths due to diseases are available. (b) No.
(c)
Yes. The following improvements in regard to wages, welfare and amenities have been
introduced ;
(1)
subsidisation of foodstuffs and the provision of grain shops ;
(2)
improved health measures including malaria control and increased provision for
construction of hospitals ;
(3)
provision of an adequate range of consumer goods for purchase;
(4)
provision of transport to and from work ;
(5)
increase in the rates for coal raisings at Railway Collieries so as to enable the
contractors to offer more attractive wages to labour; and
(6)
an informal agreement between Government and the mine-owners for an increase in the wages
of colliery labour.
(d)
It cannot be said that infant mortality is very high in mining areas due to lack of milk.
Infant mortality figure in the coalfields is less than the All-India Figure.
(e)
Pure milk is available in mining areas. Samples of milk are frequently taken and examined
by the Inspectors employed by the Mines Boards of Health and action is taken when
adulteration is discovered.
(f)
No. Government are examining further possibilities in regard to improvement of health of
women and children in mining areas.
274
[f.43]
Women Workers Working Underground in Mines
454.
Mr. K. S. Gupta : (a) Will the Honourable the Labour Member
please state the number of women workers underground in the years 1942, 1943 and 1944 ?
(b)
Is there any attempt made to reduce the number of women employed underground ? If not, why
not ?
(c)
Is it a fact that in certain coal mines women are allowed or compelled to work even in
stages of advanced pregnancy, thus giving rise to child births underground ? Was any
report to that effect brought to the notice of Government? If so, what is the action taken
to put a stop to such a malpractice ?
(d)
Would Government consider the question of applying a strict ban on women working
underground as soon as the seventh month of pregnancy is complete ? If not, why not ?
(e)
Are Government aware that maternity benefit offered to women workers is only nominal and
that several complaints are made to their immediate superiors who do not care to report to
the authorities concerned ?
(f)
Does the Honourable Member propose to make an enquiry and remedy the defects ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
(a) 1942—Nil., 1943— about 7,000,
1944—16,000.
(b)
Yes. Every effort is being made to expedite the bringing about of such conditions as would
enable Government to re-impose the ban on the underground employment of women in coal
mines. In other mines, the ban already exists.
(c)
No. So far as I am aware no children have been born underground in mines. No such reports
have ever been received. The last part of the question does not arise.
(d)
A proposal on these lines is under the consideration of Government.
(e) There are one Senior Labour Inspector and two
Junior Labour Inspectors working under the Chief Inspector of Mines to administer the
Mines Maternity Benefit Act, and every effort is made to see that the requirements of this
Act are complied with.
(f)
No.
275
[f.44]
Scheme for Recruitment of Gorakhpur Labour for Employment in Coal Mines
464.
Mr. K. C. Neogy : (a) Will the Honourable the Labour Member be pleased to explain in
detail the scheme for the recruitment of Gorakhpur labour and its employment in the coal
mines ?
(b)
What is the total number of labourers so far recruited under this scheme ? What has been
the total expenditure incurred therefor, and how much of it has been and is expected to be
recovered from the collieries in which the labourers are employed or intended to be
employed ?
(c)
What rates of wages and what amenities are these labourers entitled to, and how do they
compare with the average terms and conditions on which other labourers are engaged in the
coal mines ? What reports, if any, have been received as regards their output of work and
general efficiency as also aptitude for mining work from the different mines where they
are employed ?
(d)
What are the names of officers directly in charge of the working of the scheme, and what
are their respective duties ? What are their qualifications and experience in the line,
and what emoluments do they receive ?
(e)
From what source is the requisite finance obtained initially ? Are the accounts relating
to the scheme regularly audited under the control of the Auditor General ? Up to which
period has audit of these accounts been completed ? Has any financial or accounts
irregularity been brought to light as a result of audit of the accounts ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
(a) The labour is recruited by the Gorakhpur Labour Supply Depot in the United Provinces
for employment on various Government works as well as in the coalfield. It is organised in
gangs under the following supervisory staff:—
One
sirdar for each gang of 50 men. One unit Supervisor for each contingent of 250 men. One
camp Supervisor for each camp of 1,000 men. One Group Officer in charge of the personnel
of one or more camps according to location.
The
officer directly responsible for these labour camps is the Deputy Director, Labour Supply
(Coal) with Headquarters at Dhanbad.
The
labourers are recruited for six months or one year's service at work site or until no
longer required, whichever is shorter. Each labourer is given a set of mazri clothing and
blanket ; he is also given advances to meet initial expenses and provided free with
accommodation, medical aid, cooking fuel and rations. He is remunerated for work done on
specified scales of wages in addition to bonus for good work and long service.
(b) Total number of labourers so far recruited for
work in mines 33,500. Present working strength 15,000.
Total
expenditure incurred—Rs. 74,16,584 up to the end of January 1945.
Recoveries
Total
amount billed for up to the middle of
January
1945............... 14 V, lakhs.
Actual
recoveries ............... 5 lakhs.
(c)
Gorakhpur labour is entitled to the following wages and amenities when serving in colliery
areas : Basic wage of 12 annas per day. Production Bonus of 4 annas per day. Extra
allowance for working underground—4 annas per day. In addition the labour gets free
foodstuffs for a complete diet, the estimated cost of which is about 14 annas per day.
They are also entitled to free housing and free medical aid.
Labour
from Gorakhpur gets on the whole better terms and conditions than total labour. Total
colliery labour gets :
(i)
as cash wages 50 per cent over the pre-war total rates of wages—the pre-war rates of
wages were for an average worker about 8 annas in the case of surface workers and 14 annas
in the case of those employed underground;
(ii)
food concessions as follows : 1/2 seer of rice free for each day of attendance. Adequate
supply of dal at concession rate of 6 seers to the rupee. Such further supplies of rice
and dal as he may require at controlled rates.
The
intention of the present concession rates is to supply full ration at concession rates for
the miner himself and to require him to pay controlled rates for his family. These
concessions were introduced in May last, but previously the concessions extended to the
worker's family and were for rather larger quantities of grain. The worker is now given in
lieu an additional cash allowance of two annas in the case of a bachelor and Five annas in
the case of a married man with children.
Reports
from various sources including colliery owners show that Gorakhpur labour is adaptable to
most kinds of work such as building camps, removing over burden in quarrying schemes,
loading coal into wagons as well as cutting coal. It is also reported to be regular in
attendance, and under proper supervision, its output is as good as that of any other
labour.
(d)
(1) Mr. Walsh—Deputy Director, Labour Supply (Coal) Pay Rs. 1,925 per mensern.
(2)
Mr. Morris—Assistant Director Coal (Production). Pay Rs. 1,215 per mensern.
Mr.
Walsh is in complete charge of all matters relating to Gorakhpur labour including rations,
pay, accommodation and welfare. He has 12 years' planting experience, was 3 years' Army
Staff Officer in administrative capacity and was Labour Staff Officer at No. 3, Indian
Reserve Base for 10 months where he was responsible for original organisation of Gorakhpur
labour into Centralised force.
Mr.
Morris is in charge of the labour on work sites, output of work, provision of tools and
transport. He has handled labour of various classes during last 25 years in India and
Burma. He raised and commanded Pioneer Battalion during past two years.
(e)
The expenditure is initially debited to the head " Advance Repayable—Special
Advances " while recoveries effected from the mine owners are credited to the receipt
head " XXXVI—Miscellaneous Departments ". The difference between the
expenditure incurred and the recoveries effected is recouped from the Coal Production
Fund. The Audit Department is responsible for the audit of the expenditure. No audit or
accounts irregularities have been brought to light so far.
276
[f.45]
Late Publication of Legislative Assembly and Council of State Debates (1944 Autumn
Session)
13.
Mr. Ananga Mohan Dam : Will the Honourable the
Leader of the House please slate :
(a)
the dates on which the Legislative Assembly and Council of State Debates for the Autumn
Session (November), 1944, were made available for sale and for supply to the Honourable
Members, respectively; and
(b)
the reasons for the laic publication of those Debates ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
(a) The information is given in the statement[f.46]
attached.
(b)
The delay in the publication of the debates was due to various causes, e.g., rush of operational war work, defective
working of machines for want of replacement of spare parts and shortage of staff due to
non-availability of suitable men.
277
[f.47]
Annual Reports of Supervisor of Railway Labour, Calcutta
532.
Mr. Lalchand Navalrai: Will the Honourable the Labour Member to pleased to state :
(a)
whether the Supervisor of Railway Labour, Calcutta, has submitted to the Government his
annual reports on the working of (i) the Payment of Wages Act, and (ii) the Hours of
Employment Regulations subsequent to 1940-41 ; if so, whether these reports have been
published in full or part and whether the Honourable Member will be pleased to lay copies
thereof on the table of the House; and
(b)
if the reply to the last portion of pait (a) above is in the negative, whether the
Honourable Member proposes to supply the following information in a tabular form for each
Railway, separately, for the financial years 1941-42, 1942-43 and 1943-44 —
(i)
the amount of fines inflicted on the Railway staff; (ii) the total number of cases in
which fines were inflicted ;
(iii)
the total number of irregularities detected in the working of the Payment of Wages Act ;
(iv)
the total number of irregularities detected in the working of the Hours of Employment
Regularities ;
(v)
the nature of instruction issued to the various Railway Administrations to avoid a
repetition of such irregularities ;
(vi)
the nature of representations made by the Labour Supervisor to the Labour Department of
the Government of India on points where a conflict of opinion existed between the
Supervisor and the Railway Administrations or the Board ; and
(vii)
the decision given on points referred to in (vi) above ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
(a) Since the year 1940-41, annual reports on the working of the Payment of Wages Act and
the Hours of Employment Regulations for the years 1941-42 and 1942-43 have been submitted
by the Conciliation Officer (Railways) and Supervisor of Railway Labour. As I informed the
Honourable Member in answer to his unstarred question No. 43 on the 10th February 1944,
Government have decided not to publish these reports in view of the acute shortage of
paper. They have, however, now decided to issue a press note in respect of the reports for
the year 1942-43 as also in respect of future report until such time it is found possible
to renew the previous practice of publishing them.
(b)
Such information as is readily available is being complied and a statement will be laid on
the table of the House in due course.
278
[f.48]
Composition of Employees' Delegation to the Tripartite (Labour) Conferences
[f.49]
533. Mr. Lalchand Navalrai : Will the Honourable the Labour Member be pleased to state :
(a)
whether the Employees' Delegation to the Tripartite (Labour) Conferences or Standing
Committee is composed of representatives of—
(i)
the Indian Federation of Labour; (ii) the All-India Trade Union Congress ; and (iii) other
workers;
(b)
which industries and workers are included in category (iii) of "Other workers"
and how their representatives are elected or nominated ;
(c)
if the representatives of "other workers" are nominated by Government whether it
is proposed to discontinue the practice ; if not, why not ; and
(d)on
what basis and considerations Government nominate these delegates and whether the
Provincial Governments have any hand in such nominations ; if so, to what extent ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar:
(a) Yes.
(b),
(c) and (d). Category (iii) relates to labour interests not adequately represented on the
two all-India labour organisations, viz., the All-India Trade Union Congress and the
Indian Federation of Labour. The nominations are made by the Government of India after
taking into consideration suggestions received from Provincial Governments. It is not the
intention to discontinue the practice at least for the time being. Such nomination is
necessary at the present stage of development of workers' organisations in the country.
279
[f.50]
Hydro-Electric Schemes
539.
Mr. Manu Subedar : (a) Will the Honourable the Labour Member please state how many
hydro-electric schemes are at present functioning in India ?
(b) What is the amount of power generated by
each of them ?
(c)
How much of this power is used for industrial purposes ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
(a) 34 excluding private, industrial and military installations.
(b) It is not possible to give information
about individual stations. The total energy generated by all the stations is approximately
1983 million K.W.H.
(c)
About 56 per cent.
280
[f.51]
Hydro-Electric Schemes
540.
Mr. Manu Subedar: (a) Will the Labour Member
please state how many other hydro-electric schemes have been considered ?
(b)
How many of them are going to be dealt with by (i) the Government of India, (ii) the
Provincial Governments, and (iii) the Indian States ?
(c) What
will be the total horse-power of these schemes ?
(d) How
many of them have been already sanctioned by the Government of India ?
(e) For
how many of them is machinery either under negotiation or under order?
(f) What
is the approximate date when they are expected to function and make power available ?
(g)
Which of these schemes will be the first ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar:
(a) A large number of schemes have recently been considered ; several of them are in
various stages of investigation. Plant requirements for 31 have so far been notified to
the Secretary of State.
(b) (i) Under the present constitution,
development of Hydro Electric Schemes falls within the purview of the Provincial
Governments. The Government of India are, however, rendering them such assistance as is
asked for through the Central Technical Power Board which they have recently set up for
the initiation, co-ordination and pushing forward of electricity development schemes.
(ii) and (iii). Of the 31 schemes mentioned in
reply to part (a), 14 are being dealt with by Provincial Governments, 13 by Indian States
and 4 by private concerns.
(c)
Approximately 6,70,000.
(d) 28
schemes requiring plant before the end of 1947 have so far been approved by the
authorities concerned.
(e)
Seven.
(f)
Between the end of 1946 and 1949.
(g)
The Mohammadpur Hydro Electric Schemes of the U. P. Government will probably be the first
to start functioning out of postwar schemes.
Mr.
Manu Subedar : Is it a fact that the Government of India are unduly strict with regard to
hydro-electric projects which are submitted to them from the Provinces and from the States
?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : I
do not suppose there is any ground for believing that they are more strict than the
necessities of the case require.
[f.1]
Ibid., 14th November 1944, p. 730.
[f.2]
Legislative Assembly Debates (Central), Vol. V of 1944, 15lh November 1944, p. 780
[f.3]
Legislative Assembly Debates (Central), Vol. V of 1944, 20th November 1944, pp. 1000-01.
[f.4]
Legislative Assembly Debates (Central), Vol. V of 1944, 20th November 1944, pp. 1001-02.
[f.5]
Legislative Assembly Debates (Central), Vol. V of 1944, 20th November 1944, p. 1003.
[f.6]
legislative Assembly Debates (Central), Vol. V of 1944, 20th November 1944, p. 1003.
[f.7]
Legislative Assembly Debates (Central), Vol. V of 1944, 20th November 1944, p. 1004.
[f.8]
Legislative Assembly Debates (Central), Vol. V of 1944. 20th November 1944, pp. 1005-06.
[f.9]
Legislative Assembly Debates (Central), Vol. V of 1944, 20th November 1944, p. 1013.
[f.10]
Ibid. pp. 1013-14.
[f.11]
Legislative Assembly Debates (Central), Vol. V of 1944, 20th November 1944, pp. 1014-15.
[f.12]
Legislative Assembly Debates (Central), Vol. V of 1944, 20th November 1944, p. 1018.
[f.13]
lbid.. p. 1021.
[f.14]
Legislative Assembly Debates (Central), Vol. V of 1944, 20th November 1944, pp. 1021-22.
[f.15]
legislative Assembly Debates (Central), Vol. V of 1944, 20th November 1944, p. 1027.
[f.16]
I bid. p. 1038.
[f.17]
Legislative Assembly Debates (Central), Vol. V of 1944, 20th November 1944, p. 1038.
[f.18]
Ibid., p. 1040.
[f.19]
Legislative Assembly Debates (Central), Vol. V of 1944, 20th November 1944, p. 1040.
[f.20]
I bid., p. 1041.
[f.21]
Legislative Assembly Debates (Central), Vol. V of 1944, 20th November 1944, p. 1041.
[f.22]
lbid.. Vol. I of 1945, 9th February 1945, pp.
87-88.
[f.23]
Legislative Assembly Debates (Central), Vol. I of 1945, 9th February 1945, p. 104.
[f.24]
Legislative Assembly Debates (Central), Vol. I of 1945, 9th February 1945, pp. 109-10.
[f.25]
Legislative Assembly Debates (Central), Vol. I of 1945, 9th February 1945, pp. 116-17.
[f.26]
Legislative Assembly Debates (Central), Vol. I of 1945, 9th February 1945. p. 118.
[f.27]
Legislative Assembly Debates (Central), Vol. I of 1945, 9th February 1945, p. 121.
[f.28]Legislative
Assembly Debates (Central), Vol. I of 1945, 9th February 1945, pp. 123-24.
[f.29]
Legislative Assembly Debates (Central), Vol. I of 1945, 10th February 1945. p. 206.
[f.30]
Legislative Assembly Debates (Central), Vol. I of 1945, 14th February 1945, pp. 323-24.
[f.31]
Legislative Assembly Debates (Central), Vol. I of 1945, 14th February 1945, p. 337.
[f.32]
Ibid., 19th February 1945, pp. 454-55.
[f.33]
Legislative Assembly Debates (Central), Vol. I of 1945, 19th February 1945, p. 455.
[f.34]
Legislative Assembly Debates (Central), Vol. I of 1945, 19th February1945, p. 456.
[f.35]lbid., p. 463.
[f.36]
Legislative Assembly Debates (Central). Vol. I of 1945, 21st February 1945, p. 583.
[f.37]lbid.. pp. 583-84.
[f.38]Legislative
Assembly Debates (Central), Vol. I of 1945, 21st February 1945, pp. 584.
[f.39]
Legislative Assembly Debates (Central), Vol. I of 1945, 21st February 1945, p. 609.
[f.40]
Legislative Assembly Debates (Central), Vol. I of 1945, 21st February 1945, pp. 610-11.
[f.41]
Legislative Assembly Debates (Central), Vol. I of 1945, 21st February 1945, p. 618.
[f.42]
legislative Assembly Debates (Central), Vol. I of 1945, 21st February 1945, p. 620.
[f.43]
Legislative Assembly Debates (Central), Vol. I of 1945, 21st February 1945, p. 621.
[f.44]
Legislative Assembly Debates (Central), Vol. I of 1945, 21st February 1945, p. 629.
[f.45]Legislative
Assembly Debates (Central), Vol. I of 1945, 21sl February 1945, p. 630.
[f.46]
Statement omitted-E.d.
[f.47]
Legislative Assembly Debates (Central), Vol. II of 1915, 28th February 1945, p. 797.
[f.48]
Legislative Assembly Debates (Central), Vol. II of 1945, 28th February 1945, p. 798.
[f.49]
Answer to this question laid on the table, the questioner being absent.
[f.50]
lbid.,
p. 804.
[f.51]
Legislative Assembly Debates (Central), Vol. D of 1945, 28th February 1945. pp. 804-05.