Dr. Ambedkar As The Member
of Executive Governor General Council
Questions and Answers
______________________________________________
1
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Recent Labour Strikes in Industrial Undertakings
16.
Mr. K. C. Neogy : (a) Will the Honourable
Member for Labour be pleased to state whether during recent weeks there have been Labour
strikes in important industrial undertakings, such as iron and steel, coal and textiles ?
(b) If so, will the Honourable Member be pleased to make a
comprehensive statement dealing with the principal features of these strikes and giving in
each case the issues on which the strike was declared, the number of persons involved and the duration of the strike ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar:
(a) Certain important industrial undertakings did cease to
work for certain periods during the previous five weeks. It is not in public interest to name them or
particularise them.
(b)
It is not in the public interest that the full information asked for should be given in respect of those industrial undertakings which are engaged on important war work.
2.
In many cases cessation of work appears to have had no
connection with economic grievances;
in a few others cessation of work has been more in the nature of an ordinary
strike with demands for increase
in wages or dearness
allowance.
3.
Ahmedabad was the town in which cessation
of work were the longest—here there were no economic grievances apparent and the mills have not yet
reopened. In Bombay on date were
all mills closed, and cessation of work in those mills that
did remain closed was only of short duration—here too
no economic grievances were put forward. In Coimbatore where mills reopened and have closed again economic grievances were
to some extent apparent.
4. Apart from the cessation of work in the textile
mills of Bombay, Ahmedabad and Coimbatore, the number of industrial undertakings
which employ more than a
thousand workers each and in which work was stopped for any
appreciable time, for reasons not purely economic, was only about a dozen.
In about ten other undertakings employing about a thousand workers each, cessations of work were of a very short duration. The number of undertakings employing less than a thousand workers in which work was stopped since the 9th August for non-political reasons was less than 20.
5.
A large majority of cessations of work were in the provinces of Bombay
and Bengal, only just over
half a dozen occurring elsewhere.
6.
The Government is not aware of any sabotage in industrial undertakings by persons
who have ceased work.
7.
As regards strikes from the second week of August, which
are known to have occurred for
purely economic reasons, these numbered about 24, only seven of the
undertakings employ more than
a thousand workers.
Dr. Sir Ziauddin Ahmad: May I ask whether it has been brought to the notice of the Government that some of the factories that closed allowed their workers to go out and paid them salaries for the day ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar: Government has no definite information beyond the statement
already made. But there are indications that in some cases the things that have been referred to by my Honourable friend have in all probability
occurred.
Mr.
Lalchand Navalrai: May I know
from the Honourable Member if these strikes were closed on certain terms, or were they closed of themselves,
or with the help of the Government, on certain conditions ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar: I
do not follow the question.
Mr. Lalchand Navalrai : The Honourable Member has said that some of these
strikes ceased. Now I am asking if they did do it on certain terms given by Government, or of their own will, or whether they
ceased these strikes on any conditions ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
In some cases they went back of their own will.
Mr.
Lalchand Navalrai: May I know
from the Honourable Member if any went
on terms given by Government, and what were those terms ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : No. I am not aware of any case where Government had to give any terms to ask Labourers to resume work.
Mr.
N. M. Joshi: May I ask,
on the statement made by the
Honourable Member whether the
demands made by the workers of Bombay were placed before the Government ?
Whether he is aware that the
Bombay Girni Kamgar Union had sent to the Bombay Government more than a month ago, a statement regarding their demands about pay and other matters
?
The Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : I am aware that some demands were made, but the point that I wish to emphasise is this
that in no case in Bombay so far as I am aware, the making of grievances was the cause for the stoppage of work.
Mr.
N. M. Joshi : May
I ask if the Girni Kamgar
Union sent their demands to the Bombay Government, and if, after that, there were strikes, what is the point in the Honourable Member stating that no economic demands were made,
or no economic demands were the cause of the strike
? How did he come by that ?
The Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : I have no report from the Government of Bombay, but the information to which my
Honourable Member has referred,
is the information which I
have got from the papers.
Mr.
N. M. Joshi : May I ask the Honourable Member to enquire from the Bombay
Government whether they have taken any steps to remove grievances of the Bombay textile workers and consider the demands made by the Bombay Girni Kamgar Union ?
Sir
Cowasji Jehangir: May I ask
the Honourable Member how many
strikes there were in the textile mills of Bombay after the 8th/ 9th August ?
The Honourable Dr. B. R.
Ambedkar: There were
very few.
Mr.
Muhammad Nauman : Can the Honourable Member give any indication of the pay of the Tata
Iron and Steel Company workers
? Were
their specific demands sent to Government ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
It is not in the interests of the public to give any information.
Mr. K. C. Neogy : Does the Honourable Member know that it is published in the
newspapers ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar:
That may be so. Government will not take any responsibility.
Mr.
K. C. Neogy : This report is from the Associated Press, one
of the authorised agencies. It is stated that they struck work on the issue of a National
Government in India.
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
I
do not know what the Honourable Member means that the
Associated Press is an authorised agency.
Mr.
K. C. Neogy : I am afraid the Honourable Member does not
care to read the Government
communiqués.
Sardar Sant Singh : May I know whether it is a fact that all these strikes occurred after the arrest of Mahatma Gandhi and his co-workers
?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
Well, I cannot give definite information, but my impression
is that these strikes were not spontaneous.
Pandit
Lakshmi Kanta Maitra :
Will the Honourable Member be
pleased to state the dates on which the strikes started ? We
can draw inferences therefrom.
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
Where ? In what place ?
Pandit
Lakshmi Kanta Maitra : In Tata's.
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
As I said, I am not prepared to give any information because it is not in the public
interest to give any information.
Pandit
Lakshmi Kanta Maitra : I do not want the reasons for the strike or any such
information ; I want the dates
on which the strikes were declared.
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
I
have stated that it will not be in the public interest to give any information.
Sardar
Sant Singh : Is it a fact or not that all these strikes had
occurred after the arrest of
Mahatma Gandhi and does the Government believe or not that this shows the intensity of the movement and the following that Mahatma Gandhi
has got in the country.
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
That is an argument; it is not a question.
Mr.
N. M. Joshi: May I ask whether the strike at Jamshedpur has ended?
The Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : I believe it has.
Mr. President (The Honourable Sir Abdur Rahim) : Next question.
2
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Programme of Activities of the Utilisation Section of the Geological Survey of India
17.
Mr. K. C. Neogy: (a) Will the Honourable Member for Labour be pleased to state whether a detailed programme has been drawn up
in respect of activities of the
newly started Utilisation Section of the Geological Survey of India ?
(b) What are the minerals that are now intended to be included
within the purview of such activities ?
(c) Is it a fact that the Section will be concerned initially with pioneering work in respect of select minerals with the help of experts, while
ultimately entrusting their exploitation to suitable commercial concerns ?
(d) Is petroleum included among the minerals with which the Section is concerned ?
(e) What practical steps have been
taken so far for furtherance
of the object of this Section, and in respect of what minerals and with the help of which experts, and with what ultimate object in view
have such steps been taken ?
(f) Are the efforts of the Utilisation Section co-ordinated
with the activities of the Organisations relating to Scientific and Industrial Research and Utilisation attached to the Commerce Department ?
If so, in what manner ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
(a) Yes. The programme is, however, liable to alteration if there is urgent demand for a particular mineral.
(b)
All minerals which are required
for war purposes and for which there are reasonable prospects of working in India.
These include sulphur, mica, tungsten or wolfram, and non-ferrous
metals such as lead, zinc, copper and tin.
(c) The Utilisation Branch will with the help of experts prove deposits and undertake small-scale mining operations which may include the operation of experimental and pilot plants for smelting, etc., up to the stage when it becomes clear that production can be undertaken by Commercial firms. It is the present intention (subject to the necessity of maintaining war production and to the circumstances of each case) that at that stage commercial development should be encouraged.
(d) No, according to present
programme. (e) The Utilisation Branch has already taken steps to examine the possibility of obtaining early production of lead and zinc. The most promising lead-zinc
mines in India appear to be
the mines at Zawar in Udaipur State. The Government of India, acting through Mr. W. P. Cowen, late General Manager of the Mawchi mines in Burma, negotiated with the Mewar Government. They secured
the cancellation on payment of compensation of the lease
of the mines held by a private company, and obtained a prospecting licence from the Mewar Government. Mr. Cowen was placed in charge of the operations and began work at the end of May 1942.
Operations have been planned in two stages (1) a detailed planetable survey and deep-drilling operations to be followed
by (2) opening up of deposits
and the erection of a pilot ore-dressing
plant and smelters as soon as
drilling operations establish the workability of the tode. As a result of the Survey's progress so
far made it is hoped that it
will be possible to obtain
information regarding the "
payability ' of the tode earlier
than was originally expected. Most of the machinery required by Mr. Cowen in the way of drilling equipment, etc. has now arrived. Two Mining
Engineers, one Mechanical Engineer, two Metallurgists and three Surveyors have been appointed to assist Mr. Cowen.
Exploitation
of the sulphur deposits in the
extinct volcano of Koh-i-Sultan, has been taken over by the Utilisation Branch from the Supply Department and a Superintending Geologist of the Geological Survey of India is
in charge of the operations.
The
Branch is also engaged in an endeavour to stimulate the production of mica. A Superintending Geologist of the
Geological Survey of India is in charge of a newly-formed Mica Production
Section. It will be the work of the Branch to give all possible assistance to mica miners in
obtaining the supplies necessary for increasing production.
Investigations
have also been taken in hand by the Branch regarding wolfram, copper, etc.,
and a possibility regarding tin is receiving urgent consideration.
The
ultimate object is to make India as self-sufficient as possible in
respect of minerals which are
needed for the war effort.
(f) Yes;
the Director, Scientific and Industrial Research and a Senior official of the Commerce Department are members of the Advisory Body which
has been set up to assist this Branch.
Pandit
Lakshmi Kanta
Maitra: May I enquire, when
the Honourable Member was referring to certain types of technical staff, if they are all British officials evacuated from Burma ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar:
With regard to the two mining engineers referred to in my reply to this part of
the question, the information is this: the two gentlemen employed as mining engineers are Mr. Smith and Mr. Robottam.
Pandit Lakshmi Kanta Maitra :
Do they all come from Burma ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar:
They are Burmese evacuees. Under them there are two probationers ; both of them are Indians. Then the mechanical engineer is one Mr. Symes. He is also an evacuee. Office two metallurgists, one is an Indian—Mr. Narayan— and the other is
Mr. Fleming. There are three surveyors with regard to sulphur; they are all Indians. I may say that the reason why we had to employ these Burmese evacuees
is because they are the only people who happened to know something about mining in regard to lead
and zinc. They are all taken
from the Mawchi mines; and probably the Honourable Member knows that the Mawchi mines in Burma are the
only mines which are lead and zinc mines. We had no expert from anywhere else.
The policy of the Department
is this, that while in the first place the necessity of employing Europeans who
have experience in the mining of lead and zinc is inevitable, the department is taking steps that wherever a European is appointed there
shall be appointed under him an Indian to be trained so that when the European
vacates the Indian would be able to take charge of the department.
Pandit
Lakshmi Kanta Maitra :
The Honourable Member said just now that Mr. Cowen Started
work at the end of May 1942, and that in regard to these non-ferrous metals, zinc and lead
the appointment of British officials was inevitable. When
did it occur to the Government of India to have these mines explored ? Was it after the fall of Burma, so as to provide for these
gentlemen who have been thrown out of employment ?
The Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : I cannot give an answer to that question.
Pandit
Lakshmi Kanta Maitra :
When did the Government first take it into their head to have these mines worked in India ? What have
they been doing all this time ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar
: Probably quite spontaneously without reference to anything
external.
Sardar
Sant Singh :
May I ask whether the need for working these mines was felt
as a necessity to provide for the war effort, or was it to provide these evacuees from
Burma with some jobs ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
Certainly not ; the supplies from Burma having ceased it was necessary for the
Government of India to exploit their
own resources.
Mr.
K. C. Neogy : With reference to clause (d) of the
question, my Honourable friend stated that petroleum was not included among the minerals
at the present moment. Has petroleum been excluded from the programme
as a matter of discretion with the department or because the Government
has been committed to some other agency for the development
of petroleum in India ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
Not at all. My answer was that for the present the programme does not include it ; it does not mean that it is
excluded from the programme
altogether.
Mr.
K. C. Neogy : Will the Honourable Member be surprised I
were to tell him that Dr. Fox made a statement on the 6th of July, a portion of which I referred to yesterday, somewhat to that effect ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar :
I would like to say this to my Honourable friend, that Dr. Fox does not decide the policy
of the Government of India.
Mr.
K. C. Neogy: But Dr. Fox may at least be expected to be truthful.
Anyway, may I ask another very short question? My Honourable friend
stated that the Udaipur Durbar
had to be persuaded to cancel the lease in respect of lead and zinc mines in that State,
which had already been granted to a private party. Before getting the Udaipur Durbar
obligingly to cancel this lease, was any attempt made by the Government to find out whether an agreement could not be arrived at with that private
party for the purpose of enabling whatever activities the department wanted to carry on to
be carried on ?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar
: I must have
notice of that question.
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" Bevin Boys " Returned to India and their Employment
23.
Mr. Govind V. Deshmukh : Will the Honourable Member for Labour please state how many "
Bevin boys " have returned
to India and if all of them have got employment ? If not,
what are the reasons for their unemployment? Are any of
them taking any part in Trade Unions?
The
Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar:
149 Bevin boys have returned to India of whom 26 arrived
only on the 5th September and are now being tested by an
Examining Board. Of the remaining 123, 105 have been placed in employment with an average increase of salary of 145 per cent. Of the balance of 18, nine boys who
arrived at the end of July have been allotted to posts and will be appointed very shortly; two who do not
wish to take up factory work are being considered for Emergency Commissions—one in the Indian Army and one in the Indian Air Force ; three have refused the posts offered to
them and efforts are now being made to find them other appointments ; one is being returned to his original employment on increased pay ; one is undergoing tests with
a view to appointment as Welder Instructor at a training centre
; one has been earmarked for a post but cannot at present
be traced; and the last man was returned from England for
misconduct without completing his training.